Remote update of M172P* application

[obscuresc]

Hi,

I am currently using devices in the M172P* range with EcoStruxure Machine Expert - HVAC.

I have been updating these PLCs remotely via Modbus TCP.

So far, the experience is less than ideal, taking ~40 minutes to perform an update, and occasionally dropping out and having to restart from the beginning.

This process is also one-to-one, and hence, can't readily update multiple PLCs at once.

FTP is also less than ideal, as you can't update PARAM.* files (per advice from tech support), hence a 'complete' 'Download All' equivalent via ESME HVAC is not possible. You must also force a reboot (via other means) of the PLC in order for the application upload to take effect.

Is there a better method to federate software updates in a scalable manner? If not, is there a means that we replicate the software update process with a single board computer (Linux-based) (i.e we use Modbus through the Mini USB port)? In this way, we could create something scalable ourselves.

Thanks,

Jack

[FedericoM]

Hello,

not in the next release of ESME HVAC, but I hope next year will implement an improvement of the download times via modbus/Tcp (it's in the roadmap).

At the moment I can suggest:

- download from Installer only what is really needed in terms of update among Application, Local and Remote Display

- via FTP you can transfer a file with the format of a PARAM.DAT file which could be loaded by your project using sysUsbFileName and sysUsbCommand=116

Download times depends also on the CPU load of your application and the network band, so if you add a kind of option in your project which basically reduce the load of timed task...you should see some time improvement.

At least today, it's not possible to run ESME HVAC core on linux based OS.

[otrotabi]

Hello, thanks for sharing this. I think most of us share your thoughts. Could you further describe your current setup that allows you to  remotely access the PLCs? You have the PLCs connected to the local network and a port opened on a router ? If that is so, which ports need to be opened ?

I am also curious why you are mentioning that a reboot is needed... Isn´t that needed also with local updates as well ? It would not surprise me that some day in the future changes in software could be done without a reboot needed, but in terms of the controlled machine status, that looks harder to solve.

I´ve never had the time to give this https://thesecmaster.com/step-by-step-procedure-to-install-windows-10-on-a-raspberry-pi-4/ a try (there are many of these posts on internet, this happened to be one of the first that came up) but it looks like it is possible to setup windows 10 or 11 on a Raspberry Pi. I am aware of the eventual security issues that might represent (as well as probably extra cost, I do not know if Microsoft gives this Windows setup for free). Anyway, having an interface to be able to connect to the M172 line from Linux would be great !

[FedericoM]

A reboot of PLC is needed whenever you change something in the Client configuration of Modbus, I/O expansion allocations and BACnet (in terms of # of objects) in the configuration side.

These settings are reloaded only at boot.

Unless using a M172 Secure Interface, a Harmony ST6 or some other device providing a VPN, you need to know the public IP of the router to which M172 is connected and enable a port forwarding of port 502 of the router to the 502 of M172

[otrotabi]

Thanks.  So, basically this is it ?

However, I am missing the point regarding the reboot. What is different if local or remote control ? 

[obscuresc]

Hi all,

@FedericoM thanks for the update. Is the roadmap available for us to see? I sometimes pause application while loading. I suspect most of the delay is made up by latency due to the polling nature of Modbus and that a single poll doesn't move that much data. If I had loaded all files via FTP, and used 'sysUsbCommand', can I update everything? Regarding Linux-based computer question, I meant, could we emulate the way EcoStruxure pushes the data through Modbus for an update? If we can, we can update very readily, and in a scalable manner.

@otrotabi we use an industrial router with a VPN service with a port for Modbus set open. We very much like the idea of a Raspberry Pi, but don't want Windows on it. Because you can update via Modbus, if we can the specs on how an update is performed, we could emulate it at the edge, and not require a user-oriented connection to all our field units.

Thanks,

Jack

[FedericoM · Accepted solution]

The info related to how projects are downloaded is not public.

About the download time improvement, sorry I can't give you an exact roadmap, my guess is Q2

[FedericoM]

No differences between remote and local download, a download all requires always a reboot if you changed something in the Client configuration of Modbus, I/O expansion allocations and BACnet (in terms of # of objects) in the configuration side

[obscuresc]

@FedericoM Is it possible to open the specification for project download?

[FedericoM]

Sorry but I haven't the rights to do that