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Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

APC UPS Data Center & Enterprise Solutions Forum

Schneider Electric support forum for our Data Center and Business Power UPS, UPS Accessories, Software, Services, and associated commercial products designed to share knowledge, installation, and configuration.

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brobins3d_apc
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Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This was originally posted on APC forums on 10/22/2008


Now that our Symmetra purchased via auction is running, we turn our attention to the XR frame.

We don't get the green light in the back, nor the frame number in the front. The frame communication cable didn't come with the unit, so I tried a phone handset cable. Would this work or does it require a specially wired cable?

Is the XR frame like the power array logic where it would require at least one good battery for things to be recognized?

Bill

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BillP
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Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This reply was originally posted by Matt on APC forums on 11/5/2008


Keep in mind that while it is not recommended to run the Symmetra Extended Runtime cabinet without its built-in communications, the UPS can and will maintain the batteries inside the XR frame.

Without communication between the XR frame and Main Intelligence Module, you will not have any intelligent battery management. The UPS will not know if there are bad batteries installed in the XR frame. Manual inspection/testing/rotation of the SYBATT modules would be required.

Also, with no communication to the XR frame, the UPS will estimate runtime based on only the batteries it can "see" and "count". While the UPS is online, the UPS uses a complex algorithm including the logical battery count to estimate runtime.

However, within 60 seconds of the UPS going on-battery for any reason, the UPS throws away that previous estimate and recalculates runtime based on the actual rate of discharge of the entire battery system. It does not need communication to XR cabinets to accurately calculate runtime while it is operating on battery. As long as the XR cabinet it properly connected via the big DC cable to the main Symmetra tower, those batteries are available to the Power Modules and will be used to power the load.

I recommend correcting the communication problem, likely SYXRCC related, so that the UPS can intelligently manage those additional batteries and warn you if there are any problems.

See Answer In Context

18 Replies 18
brobins3d_apc
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Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This was originally posted on APC forums on 10/22/2008


I don't see any microlatch unless it is located inside the jack itself.

BillP
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Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This reply was originally posted by Angela on APC forums on 10/22/2008


ok, check your email.

also, if the cable doesnt work, it will probably be a SYXRCC problem.

Erasmus_apc
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Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This was originally posted on APC forums on 10/22/2008


The symmetra XR communication cable should be a straight-through RJ9. This would be similar the handset cable, yes. What are the model numbers on your Symmetra frame and the XR frame itself?

brobins3d_apc
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Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This was originally posted on APC forums on 10/22/2008


They're the tall beige cabinets. I believe it's a SY16EX and a SYBT12.

Erasmus_apc
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Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This was originally posted on APC forums on 10/22/2008


Ok, after double-checking on the particular model, you are not going to be able to use a standard handset cable, but the cable does use straight-through communication, and the connector type is RJ9. It is a 4-wire, two-line cable. You can try experimenting with your own cabling, but most likely you will need our comm. cable with part number 0W6002B. This can typically be obtained only through calling into our technical support line @ 1-800-800-4272, or you can try checking through an APC distributor.

BillP
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Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This reply was originally posted by Angela on APC forums on 10/22/2008


in addition to the cable that Erasmus mentioned, double check the little microlatch on the back of the communication card on the XR frame. this is the card that has the RJ9 connections of where you are plugging the cable into.

brobins3d_apc
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Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This was originally posted on APC forums on 10/22/2008


Just an FYI: that part number is no longer "regularly" sellable from APC. They are terming it as a parts and material item and the shipping is a flat rate of $200. No, that's not a misprint, two hundred dollars.

So, you say it's straight wired, pin 1 to pin 1, etc?

BillP
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Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This reply was originally posted by Angela on APC forums on 10/22/2008


yes, technically its not a sellable SKU and you'd have to go through the time and materials program.

if you confirm your email address is correct in your profile (you dont need type in a post), i can contact you about a cable to try.

the microlatch is basically on the card itself. it is the thumbscrew on the right hand side of the status LED that isnt lit. it is attached to a little square piece of metal which is the microlatch. make sure that screw is tight and if it is, try leaning on that square piece to see if the LED comes on so then we know thats the issue.

let me know if that helps and about the cable.

brobins3d_apc
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Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This was originally posted on APC forums on 10/22/2008


Ok, found the microlatch. No green light. Reseated card just in case and no change.

My email is correct.

Bill

brobins3d_apc
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Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This was originally posted on APC forums on 10/22/2008


That's interesting. I had an XR frame go bad at another site and assumed it was some electrical problem with the frame, but in fact it could have been the SYXRCC? Have to file that away for next time.

BillP
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Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This reply was originally posted by Angela on APC forums on 10/22/2008


i am sending you the cable but honestly, majority of the time it is the SYXRCC.

what do you see on the display on the front of the frame??

brobins3d_apc
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Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This was originally posted on APC forums on 10/23/2008


Nothing shows on the front of the frame.

BillP
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Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This reply was originally posted by Angela on APC forums on 10/23/2008


and you have the DC power cable plugged into the UPS portion, right? it is sounding more and more like SYXRCC 😕

brobins3d_apc
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Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This was originally posted on APC forums on 10/23/2008


Yes, the DC cable is plugged in.

So, it sounds like you are saying that even without the communication cable plugged in, the display should be active? Is that correct? Remember that I've got a handset cord plugged in currently, which was designated as not workable for this model of Symmetra.

BillP
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Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This reply was originally posted by Angela on APC forums on 10/23/2008


i'd have to test it to be 100% sure. i want you to try that cable i shipped to you first to be sure thats not the case. ill try and check it out tomorrow when i have access to one to check out.

regardless if its not, you will have the cable for when we fix it.

brobins3d_apc
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Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This was originally posted on APC forums on 11/5/2008


The communication cable fixed the issue. So, to reiterate, for my model of XR frame, a handset cord will not work.

Thanks for the assistance.

Bill

brobins3d_apc
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Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This was originally posted on APC forums on 11/5/2008


Interesting information. Wish I'd known that for an earlier cabinet that went bad, I wouldn't have thrown the cabinet away.

BillP
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706

Re: Symmetra Power Array XR Frame not sensed

This reply was originally posted by Matt on APC forums on 11/5/2008


Keep in mind that while it is not recommended to run the Symmetra Extended Runtime cabinet without its built-in communications, the UPS can and will maintain the batteries inside the XR frame.

Without communication between the XR frame and Main Intelligence Module, you will not have any intelligent battery management. The UPS will not know if there are bad batteries installed in the XR frame. Manual inspection/testing/rotation of the SYBATT modules would be required.

Also, with no communication to the XR frame, the UPS will estimate runtime based on only the batteries it can "see" and "count". While the UPS is online, the UPS uses a complex algorithm including the logical battery count to estimate runtime.

However, within 60 seconds of the UPS going on-battery for any reason, the UPS throws away that previous estimate and recalculates runtime based on the actual rate of discharge of the entire battery system. It does not need communication to XR cabinets to accurately calculate runtime while it is operating on battery. As long as the XR cabinet it properly connected via the big DC cable to the main Symmetra tower, those batteries are available to the Power Modules and will be used to power the load.

I recommend correcting the communication problem, likely SYXRCC related, so that the UPS can intelligently manage those additional batteries and warn you if there are any problems.